"It's crazy to hear about the riots outside of Paris. I'm American of black & white descent who spent many years in France and never felt any type of racism from French people. France is a multi-ethnic not a multi-cultural society and people must respect that if they want to immigrate there. That is just the way their culture is. Once I accepted it and tried to be as French as possible it was a wonderful experience. When people refuse to be "French", it's not at all easy."
- Chris, New York
On the Paris Suburb Riots
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mccutcheon
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Actually I think he understands the argument perfectly.
If you move to France, act French or go home. Don't try to be a square peg in a round hole.
France legally has no classification for minorities. Everyone is considered equally annoying under the law.
All these riots will promote is misguided racial hatred towards immigrants and racist votes for the National Front. When the anger dies down, the rioters will realize they've burned their own cities and now are in real shit.
It's not like France is gonna pull a million jobs out of it's ass, suddenly tolerate fundamentialist Islam or anti-French ideals, and suddenly everything is going to be honky dory.
Police are assholes everywhere. Politicians are corrupt everywhere. Life is hard everywhere. Religion is stupid everywhere. Read a book, or take drugs and dance or start a scene. That's my advice. Like Marie Antoinette said before they cut off her head... "Let them eat ecstasy."
If you move to France, act French or go home. Don't try to be a square peg in a round hole.
France legally has no classification for minorities. Everyone is considered equally annoying under the law.
All these riots will promote is misguided racial hatred towards immigrants and racist votes for the National Front. When the anger dies down, the rioters will realize they've burned their own cities and now are in real shit.
It's not like France is gonna pull a million jobs out of it's ass, suddenly tolerate fundamentialist Islam or anti-French ideals, and suddenly everything is going to be honky dory.
Police are assholes everywhere. Politicians are corrupt everywhere. Life is hard everywhere. Religion is stupid everywhere. Read a book, or take drugs and dance or start a scene. That's my advice. Like Marie Antoinette said before they cut off her head... "Let them eat ecstasy."
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mccutcheon
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FRANCE I love you oui oui oui c'est vrai!!!!
France is a racist country...even though the students at the S don't think so. They are too busy hating America to see the dog shit they step in on their own rue. Still, I love the female students and I love Paris and France and sometimes yes, I love the French. Paris has more Irish pubs- real ones not like in NYC- than any city outside of Ireland.
Still, NYC has Paddy Rielys and the best Christmas song ever written- They got cars big as bars and streets full of gold, and drunk tanks.
Still, NYC has Paddy Rielys and the best Christmas song ever written- They got cars big as bars and streets full of gold, and drunk tanks.
"The modèle républicain d'intégration is based on perhaps the most sacred article of all France's grand republican creed: that everyone is equal and indistinguishable in the eyes of the state. No matter where they come from, all French citizens are identical in their Frenchness.
It is a fine principle born of the ideals of the 1789 revolution. But it has practical drawbacks. For example, statistics based on ethnicity or religion are illegal in France; no one knows how many residents are of Arab or African origin, how they perform at school compared with white pupils, or what percentage are jobless or in prison. If analysing a problem is halfway to solving it, it is not a good start."
-The UK Guardian
It is a fine principle born of the ideals of the 1789 revolution. But it has practical drawbacks. For example, statistics based on ethnicity or religion are illegal in France; no one knows how many residents are of Arab or African origin, how they perform at school compared with white pupils, or what percentage are jobless or in prison. If analysing a problem is halfway to solving it, it is not a good start."
-The UK Guardian
ok i will be the devil's advocate here. those kids in the banlieu wearing puma trainers -- they have a false sense of entitlement. they somehow think that being in france means they should be able to make it without brains, education or effort. they do nothing but collect social security, on average.
sure, they are victims of what sociologists call social dis-integration: they no longer have the social securities and culture of africa and the maghreb, but do not yet understand the rules of western society. for this they had my sympathy, but they lost it when they started vandalising their own neighborhoods. stupid.
sure, they are victims of what sociologists call social dis-integration: they no longer have the social securities and culture of africa and the maghreb, but do not yet understand the rules of western society. for this they had my sympathy, but they lost it when they started vandalising their own neighborhoods. stupid.
Martino, I can be a better devil than that...
Imagine a scenerio where thousands of pasty-faced British kids immigrated to Japan and started burning the place down because they couldn't find jobs and no one respected them.
How much sympathy would you feel for them?
Yeah, about none.
BUT...
Like many people on this board, I've seen the entire Western Civilization from Hawaii to Moscow. I think we are taught here that Arabs and Africans are inferior culturally and intellectually and thus should be held to a lesser standard.
The kids of these non-westerners who live in the west pick up on that, feel resentment, and burn shit down to show they understand what's actually going on.
If they just sat there in silence no one would pay any attention to them. So much has been admitted by Chirac.
This is an issue with no right or wrong side. It's not us against them. It's reality against perception. And you can't win a battle like that. There will only be losers.
Imagine a scenerio where thousands of pasty-faced British kids immigrated to Japan and started burning the place down because they couldn't find jobs and no one respected them.
How much sympathy would you feel for them?
Yeah, about none.
BUT...
Like many people on this board, I've seen the entire Western Civilization from Hawaii to Moscow. I think we are taught here that Arabs and Africans are inferior culturally and intellectually and thus should be held to a lesser standard.
The kids of these non-westerners who live in the west pick up on that, feel resentment, and burn shit down to show they understand what's actually going on.
If they just sat there in silence no one would pay any attention to them. So much has been admitted by Chirac.
This is an issue with no right or wrong side. It's not us against them. It's reality against perception. And you can't win a battle like that. There will only be losers.
The typical profile of these rioters is a 16 year old suburban kid.
He looks Arab, speaks French, but is accepted by neither culture. He watches MTV, has no money, little practical education, and hates his life.
How exactly do you help someone like that?
What sort of behavior would you expect from someone like that?
He looks Arab, speaks French, but is accepted by neither culture. He watches MTV, has no money, little practical education, and hates his life.
How exactly do you help someone like that?
What sort of behavior would you expect from someone like that?
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mccutcheon
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1 big point missed
When you are 15 and out with your gang burning cars and telling the cops to fuck off is fun. Though violence is wrong. If they really want to hurt the French they should do what we did in Wisconsin when I was young. They should tip cows.
Funny you bring up tipping cows. Researchers are saying that its a myth that cow tipping is possible. I know, I know, the question is why are people researching this. But we did that as well and it is no myth. PA is probably as big a dairy state as WI.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cow_tipping
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cow_tipping
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Tommy Martyn
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I don't know about France. I do know about riots though. This is not the last of it for France. England had hers in the 80's. (Including Liverpool) The demographic and the economy is changing, consequently how the pie gets sliced is going to change. There will be winners and losers. A couple of years ago, Sloth noted the fact that the population in europe is aging. At current rates the young will have to give everything to supply the old with what they think is their entitlement. (And that is with the economy staying healthy) Obviously an economy that crushes those who produce for the benefit of those who don't, will lose out to their counterparts. So will the culture cleave across lines of race, geography, class, sex or in this case age? One thing is for sure: state pensions are going to go. The work week is going to get longer and the protectionism of thefarmers etc has to go. See editorials from the last fifteen years of the Economist for examples.
Tipping a cow and tipping a car are not the same thing. (To my shame, I have done the latter.)
Tipping a cow and tipping a car are not the same thing. (To my shame, I have done the latter.)