wow this is where the problems really start for me. i wanted to write about this, about what my fellow germans are like, months ago. and i didn't know how to do it. so i bought some books and read them. as usual, that left me more perplex than i was before.
germans are difficult. they have no body language. they dress badly and have bad manners. they, as a cohort, are related to mass murderers.
what are their redeeming qualities? quite often, i'd have to tell you, i'd be fucked if i knew. i go down to the street and see this guy i know and say hello and he pretends he does not know me. why does he do that? not because he is evil; he does that because he is german. that's just the way they do things around here.
although, of course, that is not the way they do things. some of the nicest, smartest, kindest, most intelligent and sexiest people i know are german.
i read this book a while back which was written by an ethiopian-prince-turned-german-immigrant who said that he knew of no other country where the various classes, the various segments of society, had so little to do with each other. and he is right. why greet a person who most obviously is an opposite part of society?
the 55 year old pensioner with brown socks and sandals, what does he care about me? he spent most of his life trying to get over his nazi mother and his dumbass father and now thinks that mother nature (personified by dogs and other domestic animals) is all-important and that people are evil. he travels the world, dislikes americans (or may actually love them), has a beer belly, watches porno a lot, and hates war. who cares? this kind of guy makes his own world. he scolds you when you don't separate your garbage, he likes to get drunk, he smokes and he lives healthy, he has BO... he is the ugly german everybody laughs about but did his share to create a stable pacifist eco-friendly country. in the best case...
the people
today a former government press spokesmann said dark-complexioned people should be warned against visiting certain areas in eastern germany during the games: "you might not get out alive".
his words were widely criticized and he backed down, but i am afraid he was right in saying what he did. you go to some places over there and you feel a certain barbaric atmosphere -- what gramsci called a cultural hegemony, but a hegemony of meanness. fat or ratfaced young skinheads that look like nazis and would probably gladly kill people given the slightest official incentive. if you are looking for the ugly face of germany, if you want to see the personification of hate, go over there, but try to look inconspicuous.
his words were widely criticized and he backed down, but i am afraid he was right in saying what he did. you go to some places over there and you feel a certain barbaric atmosphere -- what gramsci called a cultural hegemony, but a hegemony of meanness. fat or ratfaced young skinheads that look like nazis and would probably gladly kill people given the slightest official incentive. if you are looking for the ugly face of germany, if you want to see the personification of hate, go over there, but try to look inconspicuous.
I appreciate your writing Martino, I do think this adds to the board immeasurably. I do think Germans have a reputation for well..if not exactly outright meanness, a certain...damn I just can't think of the right word now...stuffiness? no...clinical detachment, maybe. I dunno. Something like that. Maybe the right word will come to me later. In any case I have heard of skinheads over there and racist problems with them. It is sad. But you know in the end it is Europe I think where these things are going to get played out first with Muslims and freedoms and all that. I guess I didn't really realize that until those cartoons came out.
One thing which may or may not be related to this but which I found interesting was when in Nietzsche's writings he seemed completely aware of how the German language can come across to folks who aren't familiar with it. I mean I thought it was extraordinary (brilliant even, but then he was brilliant) that this native speaker of it seemed so aware of how it might come across to someone who didn't speak it. Not only that, but I seem to recall him being quite critical of Germans himself. Maybe Sloth remembers more about the details of this than I do at the moment and can comment.
One thing which may or may not be related to this but which I found interesting was when in Nietzsche's writings he seemed completely aware of how the German language can come across to folks who aren't familiar with it. I mean I thought it was extraordinary (brilliant even, but then he was brilliant) that this native speaker of it seemed so aware of how it might come across to someone who didn't speak it. Not only that, but I seem to recall him being quite critical of Germans himself. Maybe Sloth remembers more about the details of this than I do at the moment and can comment.
Also I do feel the need to say one more time that I really do love Can and that surely they are something Germans can be really proud of. I have been playing them for like weeks in a row now, like 5 albums at a time or something, and I'm still not over them. I can't think of a better band outside of New Order/Joy Division I really can't. But I do get the feeling they were pretty egotistical and I think it's worth warning that their DVD released a few years ago was really not very good. No matter, they really piss all over Kraftwerk as far as German acts go and yeah I know that is saying something, but jeez. I know I will be playing Can for many, many years to come. And sometimes I feel bad for getting so caught up in them that I can't concentrate on new music, but I can't help it. They make it so easy.
An acquaintance of mine described their style as "steady cool", I thought that was remarkably apt.
Okay I'll be quiet now.
An acquaintance of mine described their style as "steady cool", I thought that was remarkably apt.
Okay I'll be quiet now.
martino, this is all very interesting and makes for a good read when i can't sleep. thanks.
the hubby's aunt was german. her husband, his uncle was in the army; now she is american, but she seems to really dislike being an american.
their kids are extremely cool though. anyway, she tells me about germany and brings us great drinks and that kind of stuff at christmas.
my mom speaks german (russian, french, spanish. she's pretty gifted at linguistics, but she'd never tell you that, so i'm telling you that.)
and i am actually part german, beckers, which is where i get my height, i'm told -- who actually knows in the southern united states? i mean we are all swirls down here.
when i was in france this german couple helped us figure out how to canoe. that is what i, experientially, know of germans.
i wouldn't expect there to be so much racism in germany. i guess i incorrectly expected it to be like many places in the south where because racism was legalized people had to deal with it, had to come out with it and say it was wrong, terrible, bad, we did it and we were wrong, whereas in a lot of the northern parts of the united states it still goes on sort of hushed up because it was never dealt with really and those types of things have festered / de facto segregation as opposed to de jure segregation and racism; i've been told and i agree that de facto can not be cured, de jure can.
i think the hubby did part of nato tour with germans . . . i could be wrong. i'll ask him.
your writing is interesting. thanks.
mark why are you being quiet now? because you are a boring dumbass?? i'm kidding.
don't be shy
the hubby's aunt was german. her husband, his uncle was in the army; now she is american, but she seems to really dislike being an american.
their kids are extremely cool though. anyway, she tells me about germany and brings us great drinks and that kind of stuff at christmas.
my mom speaks german (russian, french, spanish. she's pretty gifted at linguistics, but she'd never tell you that, so i'm telling you that.)
and i am actually part german, beckers, which is where i get my height, i'm told -- who actually knows in the southern united states? i mean we are all swirls down here.
when i was in france this german couple helped us figure out how to canoe. that is what i, experientially, know of germans.
i wouldn't expect there to be so much racism in germany. i guess i incorrectly expected it to be like many places in the south where because racism was legalized people had to deal with it, had to come out with it and say it was wrong, terrible, bad, we did it and we were wrong, whereas in a lot of the northern parts of the united states it still goes on sort of hushed up because it was never dealt with really and those types of things have festered / de facto segregation as opposed to de jure segregation and racism; i've been told and i agree that de facto can not be cured, de jure can.
i think the hubby did part of nato tour with germans . . . i could be wrong. i'll ask him.
your writing is interesting. thanks.
mark why are you being quiet now? because you are a boring dumbass?? i'm kidding.
don't be shymartino, i have to say, so i don't offend mark with one-sidedness, that there are plenty of places in the south that are like what you are describing in terms of racism. i have lived there too.
(mark i'm just teasing you i hope you know that. i think of you guys like i would think of weird cyber brothers. i know how you like primus "my name is mud" -- spell it backwards.)
(mark i'm just teasing you i hope you know that. i think of you guys like i would think of weird cyber brothers. i know how you like primus
"my name is mud" -- spell it backwards.)marky, sarah, everybody else: i appreciate your warm comments on my odd thoughts. you motivate me to continue on with this bloggish, stream-of-consciousness, regardless-of-embarassment thread.
and please continue to give me your feedback on whatever you think, in fact whatever comes to mind, be it Can, the south, whatever.
and please continue to give me your feedback on whatever you think, in fact whatever comes to mind, be it Can, the south, whatever.
the guardian, on today's germany
"Strangers in a strange land
When Luke Harding and his family moved to Germany two years ago, they expected to find a cleaner, more efficient version of Britain. What they got was a country ruled by the old, for the old - but with great trains, great hospitals and a rather charming love of nudity"
spot on, if you ask me:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/germany/artic ... 78,00.html
When Luke Harding and his family moved to Germany two years ago, they expected to find a cleaner, more efficient version of Britain. What they got was a country ruled by the old, for the old - but with great trains, great hospitals and a rather charming love of nudity"
spot on, if you ask me:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/germany/artic ... 78,00.html
simmering, i would say...
there is so much disagreable to be said about germans. their rudeness, their naivity, their unthinking idealism, their love of animals and dislike of children, how they think ugly things are less superficial than beautiful things... 'talent-killers' is what volker schlöndorff calls his people. i could go on and on.
and i will, later. but for now, how about the good things.
well, this comes to mind, spontaneously. this is a country in which the mayor of the capital is a proud homosexual; nobody got uptight about that. the people are tolerant; prostitution is legal, gays seldomly get bashed, all kinds of sexual freedoms are enjoyed. we have a female head of government who is from the part of the country that was communist a mere 16 years ago. the press is pretty good.
the educational system is a dream if you want to spend six years in university, studying what you want with little stress and practically zero costs. the freeways are toll-free and, with some luck and good planning, you can drive 500 miles in 7 hours. the train system is a dream. apartment rents are pretty low. in about a score of cities, the cultural infrastructure is great -- good concert halls, opera, museums, nice cafés, what have you.
you can smoke as much grass as you want, in public if you do it descreetly, with no risk of getting busted. no country in europe has been more generous in letting asylum-seekers in. the penal system is fair and humane. taxes are low. the medical system is excellent and if are lucky enough to have a job, or if you are a student, you get free medical care. the cops are, all in all, friendly and not corrupt -- 911 is not a joke over here. assuming you have a job again, you get (depending on the industry) 28-35 paid days vacation, and you take it too.
this is all nice and comfortable, or even paradise if you like it. in many ways i certainly do. it doesn't change anything about the fact that in certain ways, the country feels like a place "that is ruled by old people, for old people". generally however, that aspect is getting better and the system is starting to take better care of the interests of the young and poor. here's hoping that is a long-term trend.
and i will, later. but for now, how about the good things.
well, this comes to mind, spontaneously. this is a country in which the mayor of the capital is a proud homosexual; nobody got uptight about that. the people are tolerant; prostitution is legal, gays seldomly get bashed, all kinds of sexual freedoms are enjoyed. we have a female head of government who is from the part of the country that was communist a mere 16 years ago. the press is pretty good.
the educational system is a dream if you want to spend six years in university, studying what you want with little stress and practically zero costs. the freeways are toll-free and, with some luck and good planning, you can drive 500 miles in 7 hours. the train system is a dream. apartment rents are pretty low. in about a score of cities, the cultural infrastructure is great -- good concert halls, opera, museums, nice cafés, what have you.
you can smoke as much grass as you want, in public if you do it descreetly, with no risk of getting busted. no country in europe has been more generous in letting asylum-seekers in. the penal system is fair and humane. taxes are low. the medical system is excellent and if are lucky enough to have a job, or if you are a student, you get free medical care. the cops are, all in all, friendly and not corrupt -- 911 is not a joke over here. assuming you have a job again, you get (depending on the industry) 28-35 paid days vacation, and you take it too.
this is all nice and comfortable, or even paradise if you like it. in many ways i certainly do. it doesn't change anything about the fact that in certain ways, the country feels like a place "that is ruled by old people, for old people". generally however, that aspect is getting better and the system is starting to take better care of the interests of the young and poor. here's hoping that is a long-term trend.
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mccutcheon
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mark why are you being quiet now? because you are a boring dumbass?? i'm kidding. Smile don't be shy
Well I was being quiet because I was at work and dealing with class and mundane errands that I have to deal with during the week! Not being *willfully* silent, just for the record, eh? "Precious Time" is a song by Pat Benetar that fits here, but never mind. Damn that is a great album, though you know what? That is the only Pat Benetar album worth owning. "Precious Time" on vinyl by Pat Benetar. I played it again a few years ago for the first time since it came out in 1981 and it still sounded great! Don't bother with any of her other albums, though, this is it, this is the only one.
Seattle weather is really doing a weird weird thing today. It's half sunny, half grey. I mean I'm serious the sky does NOT know what it is going to do, rain or shine. It is exactly 50/50 today. The green leaves outside don't tell me where it 's going to go. They are backed by 97% grey and a bit of blue.
I'm going to pretend I'm in Ireland for a moment, excuse me.
Well I was being quiet because I was at work and dealing with class and mundane errands that I have to deal with during the week! Not being *willfully* silent, just for the record, eh? "Precious Time" is a song by Pat Benetar that fits here, but never mind. Damn that is a great album, though you know what? That is the only Pat Benetar album worth owning. "Precious Time" on vinyl by Pat Benetar. I played it again a few years ago for the first time since it came out in 1981 and it still sounded great! Don't bother with any of her other albums, though, this is it, this is the only one.
Seattle weather is really doing a weird weird thing today. It's half sunny, half grey. I mean I'm serious the sky does NOT know what it is going to do, rain or shine. It is exactly 50/50 today. The green leaves outside don't tell me where it 's going to go. They are backed by 97% grey and a bit of blue.
I'm going to pretend I'm in Ireland for a moment, excuse me.
franz ferdinand's nick mccarthy, on germans
he usually has some interesting things to say...
http://service.spiegel.de/cache/interna ... 15,00.html
http://service.spiegel.de/cache/interna ... 15,00.html
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mccutcheon
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- Contact:
Martino (I wish he was my best friend!) But he is my great f
this is all well and good but I want your words! and for those who can't be there at kick off you better be spewing them forward!!!!!! This is your chance to shine on crazy diamond!
word!
your interest is appreciated, good friend. however -- as coincidence has it, i am currently working 16-hour days, which really sucks. there is this 100-aspirin job that is really costing me my nerves, but what can you do? anyway, i can only post here sometimes, which may or may not be often. sorry! (but, quite frankly: there are only two or three people reading this, anyway...)
as coincidence has it, by the way, everything is beautiful here right now. we had an extremely cold and wet may but now there's only sun, sun, sun, and each day it gets a bit warmer. the opening game (tomorrow) will see summerly temperatures.
the town has been freshened up, all kinds of construction sites have been finished and closed down, and there is a general atmosphere of warmth and pleasure that i really like. this is official, for the next four weeks: no restrictions on partying, both public and private, until 1AM! it's a bash. wish you were here.
as coincidence has it, by the way, everything is beautiful here right now. we had an extremely cold and wet may but now there's only sun, sun, sun, and each day it gets a bit warmer. the opening game (tomorrow) will see summerly temperatures.
the town has been freshened up, all kinds of construction sites have been finished and closed down, and there is a general atmosphere of warmth and pleasure that i really like. this is official, for the next four weeks: no restrictions on partying, both public and private, until 1AM! it's a bash. wish you were here.